June 18, 2013 21:07

Breaking Zeek Rewards News: Kenneth D. Bell Rex Venture Group LLC Receiver Uncover More Assets

Sep 13 2012 in Paul Burks, Zeek Rewards News, Zeekler, ZeekRewards by Troy Dooly

What started over the weekend with emails being circulated by David Kettner, that the SEC acknowledged that there are a couple of problems with the case against Rex Venture group. Has now made it to the desk of the Zeek Reward Reciever Kenneth D Bell, who denies these rumors “False information is being circulated by these claimants.” This backs up the information shared by Jordan D. Maglich of PonziTracker.com who published yesterday “SEC Admissions Of Weakness In Zeek Case “Inaccurate”; Tactics and Motivations of Zeek Victim Group Questioned”

[quote]September 13, 2012

Kenneth D Bell

Many of you are asking what the Receiver has been doing since August 17, 2012. Among a great many other tasks required by the Court’s Order, we have made it the first priority to secure Receivership Assets. As of today we have secured nearly $300,000,000.00 in Receivership Assets. There may be tens of millions of dollars more of recoverable assets. This process will take time, and I ask your patience while we seek every recoverable dollar for victims of Rex Ventures Group LLC. While many of you are understandably anxious to begin the claims process, we simply can’t do that until we are reasonably certain we have recovered all assets from which victims can be compensated. This process will take months, if not longer.

Among those from whom we intend to recover assets are those affiliates who took more out of Rex Ventures than they put in. Many of you received little or nothing from this enterprise. In order to make everyone as whole as possible, those who profited from participating should surrender their gains.

We hope to soon post an information template for you to complete. This is not an official claim form, but it will allow us to begin collecting your information for future claims processes, and better enable us to communicate with you.

Finally, I read in many emails and web postings that some affiliates claim to have spoken to me or the SEC. False information is being circulated by these claimants. I have not spoken to any of those claiming to have done so. I will communicate with you through this web site. If I could answer all of the hundreds of thousands of emails and calls from you I would, but obviously I can’t. I also recommend that you consider only what the SEC posts on its web site for its position on this matter.

Thank you for your patience and support as we work for the benefit of all victims of Rex Ventures Group LLC. I commit to keeping you as informed as possible.

Kenneth D. Bell
Receiver[/quote]

You can learn more information by visiting ZeekRewardReceivership.com

Mr. Bell works in the firm’s rapidly growing Government, Regulatory and Criminal Investigations Department, where he represents clients on a variety of matters involving white collar crimes and business-related investigations. As part of his practice, he routinely represents Fortune 500 companies facing federal and state grand jury investigations.

Representative Matters

Representation of Speaker of the North Carolina House of Representatives during federal, state and regulatory investigations.

Representation of a Fortune 500 company in federal grand jury investigation and civil securities litigation related to allegations of stock option backdating.

Representation of a national property and casualty insurance company in federal grand jury and civil investigations regarding federally insured program.

Representation of a national home builder and mortgage company in class action civil litigation regarding sub-prime mortgage issues.

Representation of a Big Four accounting firm during investigation by state agency of tax planning strategies.
Conducted internal investigation for major financial institution regarding commission compensation practices.

Representation of a principal of a hedge fund regarding a federal grand jury investigation.

Representation of a national construction company during federal grand jury investigation of municipal water project.

Representation of accountants and medical professionals before licensing boards.

Representation of officers and directors of financial and commercial companies during federal grand jury investigations.

Representation of major financial institutions, accounting firms and large corporations in matters of government and internal investigations.

Counsel of record for more than 100 cases before the U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals for the 4th Circuit.

Primary trial responsibility in more than 200 federal cases, with more than 75 jury trials.

Government investigations regarding commercial and financial frauds, Foreign Corrupt Practices Act, money laundering, public corruption, healthcare fraud, RICO, tax, terrorism, and environmental crimes.

Troy Dooly

Troy Dooly is recognized internationally as an influencer in the areas of personal branding, leadership development, marketing campaigns, organizational expansion, and corporate launch strategies. Dooly is a speaker, results coach, and radio host. He is a founding member, show host (Beachside CEO) and News Director of the Home Business Radio Network. He is a founding member, and currently serves on the Board of the Association of Network Marketing Professionals

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77 Comments »

  • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

    Troy, just heard that Craddock plans to file “harassment” complaints against you as per Youtube terms of service via his latest announcements.

    Sounds like more hot air to me.

    • Troy Dooly

      @K.Chang,

      Well it will not be the first time that has happened :)

      • logic

        to all Zeekers:

        “Thank you for your patience and support as we work for the benefit of all victims of Rex Ventures Group LLC. I commit to keeping you as informed as possible.”

        Kenneth D. Bell
        Receiver

        You already have an Attorney to do all the work to recover your funds.

        Mr. Troy,
        I believe that you know and understand the recovery process. And since many affiliates find you credible, it would be comforting to hear you encourage them to have patience.

        • Troy Dooly

          @Logic,

          I have done that several times in the comments, but I believe you are right and will do a post soon. Thank you for suggesting it.

      • Scott Cunnyngham

        The way I read Craddock’s post is that he felt it was not necessary to file a complaint.

        Did I miss something?

        • Troy Dooly

          @Scott,

          I have been focused on business today, and can’t answer that. I have responded to what others have stated.

        • Chris Bailey

          Yes Scott, Craddock said it wasn’t necessary because his warnings about following the “internet clowns” had made the amount of views for Troy’s latest video significantly decrease and Troy’s “short term fame is fading”.

          Of course, the fact that Troy’s video was not harassing, but was instead a response to Craddock’s claims of betrayal and other nonsense had nothing to do with him not submitting a complaint.

          As usual, he was just blowing smoke.

  • Dan Nguyen

    These blood sucking dogs should be ashamed of themselves for spreading false information and scamming tactics…

  • Chris Bailey

    And Dave Kettner’s advice to Zeek affiliates regarding this information from the receiver is:

    “Some people have been receiving generic emails from the receiver…please disregard as it is nothing important.”

    • Troy Dooly

      @Chris,

      Hmmm… Sure seems some folks are getting a little cocky these days. Lord knows I have a boatload of questions, but to discount anything the Receiver might say or send out, just seems stupid to me!

  • http://realscam.com GlimDropper

    Howdy Troy,

    I in no way consider myself an expert but I’ve been to the rodeo enough to know most of the barrels the clowns are hiding in.

    As to your question about the “points deal,” VIP points are completely meaningless to the receiver. The only consideration is actual cash put in and actual cash taken out.

    If you’ve taken out less than you put in you will be in line for a refund. If you’ve taken out more than you put in, what’s the opposite of a refund? This is why a few of us kinda chuckled when Dawn started using the term “clawback.”

    I think some people are waking up to the notion that a group of 12 people who includes some of the top “earners” in Zeek are so desperate to raise funds. It’s because one day, perhaps soon they’ll be given formal notice of the debt they owe to all the people who lost money in Zeek.

    It galls me that these 12 winners are collecting money from some of those who lost money in Zeek, to pay for the fight against giving those people their full refund.

    There have been a number of updates and statements that have come out today from the Craddock/Kettner/Dinser crew. I doubt their worth the dignity of a reply. But I’ve been aggravating them over at RS. I want as complete an archive of their activities as possible in case any of it becomes admissible.

    • Troy Dooly

      @GlimDropper,

      As always thank you for taking time away from your community to educate both myself and others here in our community.

  • Jesse Meyer

    I understand they want to get “all” the money back but this Clawback is going to ruin lots of lives considering people were using money from Zeek Rewards to pay their bills, not go out and buy BMW’s and such things.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Jesse,

      I can see your point, but that is not necessarily the truth. Attorney Jordan Maglich wrote a great article at Forbes on this very subject.

      The exact part reads as follows…

      “Kathy B. Phelps, a California lawyer who recently authored a book on unraveling Ponzi schemes, agrees that clawback suits are likely, but observed that the receiver could also take into account “issues of hardship and collectibility”.

      So although, there is a possibility that some ot the smaller Zeek Affiliates could get contacted about clawbacks, I have a feeling the SEC is looking at those who were the original promoters who had multiple positions at the top of the matrix, more than just trying to cause hardship to the average person.

    • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

      And what’s the alternative? Let them keep their gains, and tell the rest of the victims “tough luck”?

      At the MINIMUM the top 50% of those who took out more than than put in need to pay back what they “got”. (I’m just using 50% as an arbitrary number).

      Zeek ended up with only a few people with bazillion VIP points, and we KNOW that 12 of them Zeek verified as taking out 1 million a month. So this is a VERY STEEP pyramid, with those on top earning BIG bucks, and the rest earning little to nothing (and then you have those that LOST money).

      Is it any wonder that Craddock’s crew said 12 people were gonna meet SNR Denton’s lawyer, and now, “mystery lawfirm” yet to be named?

  • http://www.webtemplatecollections.com Mary Mcknight

    I have no skin in this game either way but having seen Zeek from the inside as a contractor, I am so incredible glad to see people here, on behindmlm and on Troys sites working together to put true and correct info out there to protect the people harmed by this scam. My hat is off to each of you. I think it is despicable that anyone would try to take money from people who already lost in this deal. They are only further victimizing them and it is reprehensible. May this all work out for each of you. Hopefully all the backstabbing and name calling among the groups is over and you can all work together and focus your collective power at those that deceived and took advantage of the affiliates. God Bless. – Mary

  • maria1965

    TROY WHAT HAVE YOU DONE … I CANNOT BELIEVE
    THAT YOU THINK YOU ARE HELPING US AFFILIATES?

    WELL…

    YOU HAVE A NEW FRIEND NOW … MR BELL THE RECIEVER … WHO ALL OF A SUDDEN WANTS TO UPDATE ALL US VICTOMS ON YOUR WEBSITE!!

    WOW!!!

    • Troy Dooly

      @Maria1965,

      Hmmm… Mr. Bell did not update you on my site. However, as I have done each time he posts current news, I do make sure we post it on this site also.

      And yes, I beleive by keeping all affiliates informed it is helping them out. It doesn’t matter which lawsuit they are a part of or not a part of, keeping them inform is important.

      As it stands Kevin Thompson and his firm seem to represent the largest amount of affiliates who just want to get their money back. And since the other two lawsuits are pretty small classes right now, that leave millions of affiliates seeking information.

      And, well since Mr. Bell does hold the winning hand in this poker game right now, and he sure doesn’t seem to be running any kind of a bluff on folks, I figure we had better publish what he has to say.

      • lee kim

        hi troy!
        how can i contact Kevin Thompson?

      • going 2 work

        I have watched the ___ and the ___ go on for the past month and it reminds me of the movie the Day After Tomorrow
        nuclear Holocaust and what it might look like.

        I hate writing because I am not always understood.

        I can speak very well and if you know me you will not think you know me from this comment.

        You always say you report to help affiliates, well the affiliates really need a neutral person that really is on the affiliates side and can tell all the truth in a private place to only the affiliates.

        You have stated in many your vids how these to leaders should act like people and talk
        the Goverment IS NOT on THE SIDE OF THE Affiliates

        My understanding is Shallow so dont start preaching to me

        Preach to the Affiliates that really Believe your a good Voice

        Bring SRN Denton To interview Or kevin Grimms to advice the Affiliates

        Should there be ONE voice For 1.2 to 2 million affiliates

        Can that be orchastared by a sub team of uplines for the GOOD OF ALL
        or will greed be MANS downfall

        If you don’t understand any I say please delete the post

        • Troy Dooly

          @Going To Work,

          Thank you for taking time to write, when it is not as easy as speaking. I fully understand where you are coming from. Let’s look at what you have written.

          1. There are days where this saga does look like something from the movies, and not a real life nightmare. But, with continued communication I do believe the affiliates (which have now been broken into two classes… victims and profiteers) will have their voice heard no matter which class they are in.

          2. I can understand your thoughts on a “neutral person” on the affiliates side, and I am not sure that is something that can happen. Every person who has followed Zeek Rewards over the last few months has drawn their own conclusions based on their worldview of the situation.

          I do my best to provide all the facts from all sides, but I am far from un-biased. I’m just willing to listen and learn and realize I am way over me head when it comes to fully understanding the laws that do govern ponzi programs.

          I still firmly believe based on the my own personal experiences, facts and observations, that Rex Venture Group, LLC did not create Zeek Rewards to be run as a ponzi. And I do not believe the legal, compliance and compensation teams hired to make sure RVG was running ZR correctly were wrong in the advice they gave.

          But, I am open minded and realistic enough to also understand, that the true motives of humans are at times are kept even from those closest to them, let alone the ones they hire to cover up these motives. Which is why I would love this whole case to go to trial.

          But to expect a truly un-biased person to report on this, may not happen. Although there are professionals who are providing some solid commentary on this situation based on their professional insights. And, I would question any “private” information that might be given to affiliates. What guarantee would you have that the information is correct, if it is not cross-examined?

          Would this not be a similar situation as that Paul Burks just did with the SEC. In “private” he provided information to the SEC which led them to believe the RVG was running one of the world’s largest ponzi schemes? And because of these private conversations, the closure has effected the lives of upwards to 2 million people?

          In private there are no checks and balances to the information provided. There are times when private conversations are best. But when the lives of 2 million people are at risk, public conversation, where cross-examination of what is being said is best.

          3. You may be right and the Government is NOT on the side of the affiliates. “The mission of the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission is to protect investors, maintain fair, orderly, and efficient markets, and facilitate capital formation.”

          Based on the above Mission Statement, the move they made was done in the best interest of the affiliates, even if many will debate if the closure is within the Mission Statement.

          4. I would never preach to or at you. Lord knows there is much I do not understand myself. No matter what has happened, I have learned much and I am continuing to learn, as I am sure you and others are.

          5. SNR Denten is not a part of this case period, and because they were retained, then later decided not to take the case, they can not talk about it from my understanding. Kevin Grimes, who I do communicate with regularly on other issues can’t talk about this case due to the fact he was a counsel of record, and the case has many lawsuits pending.

          I am working to get some interviews with professionals who may be able to talk about the generalities of the case because I do believe it would serve the affiliates well.

          6. Attorney Kevin Thompson is working to be the one Voice for the affiliates. To my understanding the largest group of affiliates are now part of his Recovery Efforts to get the highest refunds for the former affiliates.

          Now with that said please understand that with two classes of affiliates now created do to the voluntary Consent and Surrender of Rex Venture Group, LLC.’s assets to the SEC.

          Those who are worried about clawbacks, have yet to find a law firm willing to take all of them on as clients (one voice). However, there is one guy, who is raising funds from many affiliates so he can afford an attorney to represent himself. And I think he now has an advisory board of 12 of the highest “profiteers” who it is purported will be filing a lawsuit soon. if this case is filed, then maybe, this law firm will be willing to represent a class of “profiteers” with one voice.

          I admit I may not have understood all you were writing. And I hope you understand that in my heart I was not intending to preach at you.

          I feel we both want the same things… Truth and Justice in this situation for the affiliates.

  • http://MLMHelpdesk Russ Brown

    I know this comment seems naive, but Nobody got hurt until the SEC shut Zeek down. Then we all got hurt.
    And we can be sure that Kenneth Bell will collect commisions for his work in receivership. Sadly, everything in this life is about the money, especially when people empowered by the government have the control.

    The “found” money appeared when Bell opened the mail containing the monies NOT in the Zeek accounts yet. That was NOT RIGHT Anyway you slice it! It is very hard to believe that this govenrment is trying to “protect” us…

    • Troy Dooly

      @Russ,

      Not naive at all. We on the outside do not see anyone getting hurt, I agree. And from talking to folks on the inside (who did not have access to the financial records or internal accounting) they do not see anyone getting hurt.

      But, we have to take into account that Paul Burks did provide some of the financial numbers to the SEC and in their opinion Zeek was about to collapse. Now could Paul Burks, have only showed them enough to get them to think that because he was tired and wanted out, sure! But I really doubt that happened.

      In their mind the company had gone to far to right the ship. I know there were plenty of changes that were being launched on Aug 22nd. I wanted some of those to be in place months earlier and maybe this would not have happened. But since they were not put in place, the SEC made a move to save as many of the assets as they could for the victims.

      There is more that we can be sure of, than Kenneth Bell collecting commissions for his work. This is the same excuse that is used when I write against a company or organization for hurting others.

      Read up on Mr. Kenneth D. Bell’s background, then decide if he is only in this for the money! Yes he gets paid and will get paid very well for what he is very good at. But, you need to also ask yourself what the agenda is for anyone who files a lawsuit! Make sure you fully understand who is on your side and who is looking out for themselves.

      By the way, the found money came from financial accounts that neither he nor the SEC knew existed at the time. I know this because they were not first listed, and later those companies did come forward and the Receiver also uncovered some. And at the time of the filing the SEC did not know how much was being held in Trust and reserve by several financial institutions to protect those financial institutions against charge back and fraudulent checks.

      I am not a fan of big government and any agency just running over US citizens, and I want to see this complaint cross-examined and defended. And I beleive sooner or later that will happen. But in the mean time, Zeek is not coming back, and there are funds being held wrongfully which needs to be released so folks can get on with their lives.

    • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

      A victim, who’s NOT AWARE that he’s a victim, is a victim nonetheless.

      Or to mix my metaphors: do you prefer living in the Matrix and enjoy that virtual “juicy steak”, instead of the reality that you’re a bio “battery” for the machines?

      Technically Neo isn’t aware he’s a “battery” (or victim) until Morpheus freed him. So by your definition, Neo is NOT a victim of the machines, until Morpheus freed him.

  • Carpe

    Regarding the claw back, in other ponzi case which I read – info from N_Norway from behind MLM – yes, the receiver also put in account the issue of hardship and collectibility, but the individuals still have to pay back some amount, and can arrange to pay back over a period of time as well. So, yea… If people used Zeek money to pay bill, then they just have another debt added on their list. Just that the debt is affordable to pay back in a short period of time.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Carpe,

      This is true it could happen. But something else should also be realized. There has never been situation where the SEC took over a company with this type of compensation plan. In most cases top promoters make money and others get screwed. In the case of Zeek Paul Burks was following a dream of allowing the average person to earn money.

      Now without a doubt that dream has turned into a nightmare, but we are still not sure what will happen. It is still an election year, and I am not sure the current administration wants to a bloodbath of negative media hitting them because some average and normal US citizens are now having to join the ranks of welfare just to pay an SEC clawback.

      • Chris Bailey

        “There has never been situation where the SEC took over a company with this type of compensation plan.”

        Troy, this is where you and critics part ways.

        There was nothing unique about the legitimate part of the comp plan where people earned commissions on downline bid purchases, and the occasional retail bid purchase.

        The other part of the comp plan, the RPP, is what got Zeek shut down.

        That part was pure ponzi and no different than any other ponzi before it or after it.

        The moment Zeek Rewards opened their doors telling people that they would make 125% ROI on bid purchases they were just another ponzi.

        That ROI promise and expectation is the only reason Zeek grew like it did because it caught fire on the ponzi forums like MMG and TG.

        If Paul Burks had not manipulated the RPP to give members an average of 1.5%/day ROI, Zeek would have crashed months ago because the ROI would not have been greater than the spends and people would have started cashing out faster and faster.

        “In most cases top promoters make money and others get screwed. In the case of Zeek Paul Burks was following a dream of allowing the average person to earn money.”

        Paul Burks was spewing the same type of BS that Andy Bowdoin of ASD, Kim Inman of YMMSS, Fred Mann of JSS, and every other one of these ponzi owners do.

        After years and years of fine tuning some magical system, they’ve finally found a way for the average Joe to make real money online with no skills, no experience, and little to no effort.

        Insiders, top promoters, and early birds still make out like bandits.

        • Troy Dooly

          @Chris Bailey,

          I may not have been clear in my thoughts, which might be causing confusion.

          I agree that there is a legit and common part to the compensation structure. I also realize there are a huge amount of folks who made part-time and full-time income from that part of the comp plan. And correct me if I am wrong, but I do not think any of us have ever disagreed on this part of the compensation structure?

          Heck I don’t think we have ever disagreed on any part of the compensation structure, I think all we have ever disagreed on is the intent behind the creation of the compensation structure.

          And we have always agreed on the original marketing that took place (125% ROI was illegal.) My original editorial covered this very issue.

          And we are in total agreement that one of the issues which got RVG shutdown was the RPP because the SEC classified it as an “unregistered security”.

          I will concede that in part ZR grew because of the ponzi boards. It also grew because traditional networkers also got involved. Not to the same degree as the ponzi players, but a huge amount of them.

          Now, here is where we do still do not fully see eye to eye on things, but which I do think we are closer than we may realize.

          1. When I mention “not like other ponzi schemes” I am talking about the use of gamification physiology (points & winners). By playing into what works for traditional businesses and has been growing among traditional network marketing companies millions of Zeek Rewards affiliates were more interested in watching their points grow, than they were in just taking out money.

          Since these folks were making money from the traditional part of the compensation plan, they did not focus on pulling money out at the end of the 90-days. Instead they focused on watching the points raise and “dreaming” about what life would be like when they were able to accumulate enough points to draw down their “cash available” and it would be more than their current monthly income.

          I have many emails from folks who have been very clear, that they had been in for over a year and had NEVER started earning any income from the RPP because they had not started pulling the 80/20 “cash available”.

          I am under the impression, that in a traditional ponzi scheme, you are guaranteed to put x-amount of dollars in, and you get z-amount of dollars out. Here, the focus was on growing points, and not pulling money out. And when you did pull money out, make sure you are keeping your withdraws at a 80/20 pull.

          Now, I can say from what I have seen in the back office snapshops that have been sent to me and from around the internet, it does seem that many of the top affiliates, (if these are not altered) were pulling far more than a 80/20 split.

          There is also one other scenario that I do not see as normal in other ponzi or purported ponzi schemes. That is the lack of understanding of in this case the RPP.

          Because RVG did, hire some of the most respected names in network marketing. Put a huge public campaign on for compliance, and yes, contacted me and was willing to listen to what I saw as red flags and committing to fixing them, which did get me to cover these changes and continuing issues. And were willing to turn over the company to an outside group of professional executives. I and others did see this as a team of folks who got some wrong advice early on from some former promoters in the auto surf niche, but who were willing to make changes in order to create a long term new type of internet based direct marketing income opportunity.

          Chris, because I am not an expert with how ponzi promoters create and market their programs, I will, without reservation state, I may be 100% wrong, and what I see as unique may be just common practice, and all of the above is just business as usual.

          Now I will say were are not on the same page when it comes to the allegations on Paul Burks “manipulated the RPP to give members an average of 1.5%/day ROI” not because this might not turn out to be the truth. But because, when I review my notes, I tracked the amount of percentage used. During the week days when employees were in the office and depositing money, the daily was close to 1.2% to 1.5%, on the weekend the numbers always were under 1%, when all that could be counted was the eWallet and at times credit card buys. This does not seem on the surface to be just a “pull a figure out of my butt” mentality.

          Now where I will concede that there could have been an issue with what Burks was doing, is if he did not take into account chargebacks, fraudulent checks, or any other financial issues that might come up.

          Now, to further help you realize I am not just holding ground because or pride, I want you to see how the daily ROI was explained to me. If this is wrong, please let me know. Lord knows many are as clueless as I may be on how all this worked.

          If RVG took in $100 million on Monday, after all expenses were calculated, and the net revenue was provided to Paul, he would measure than against the qualified RPP affiliates and their points for the day, and determine the ‘ROI”. So if the net revenues were $100 million for the day, and the RPP payout was $150 million, then the following day, the company would have started the day $50 million down.

          If all that came in that day was $50 million and the company had no additional costs, and at the end of the day had NO net revenue, then the RPP ROI for the day would have been 0%.

          Now, again, I could be totally wrong, or was informed wrong. Which is why I would personally like to see this in open court, so all the facts could be presented, cross-examined, defended and a judge or jury rule on this evidence.

          So, in closing, I am not holding firm and fast that those behind the scenes who helped to create this program, could not have had a hidden agenda that was not shared with the network marketing attorneys, compliance, compensation, trainers, and advocates. Nor am I saying that Mr. Paul Burks could not be a mastermind criminal. Nor am I stating I believe Mr. Paul Burks is innocent and only did all he did because he was afraid for his families life because of some international ponzi/terrorist organization who had threatened his family (that was a funny email), or that Dawn or DD or anyone else could not have fooled me and others.

          I am just saying for the peace of mind of all involved, we would love to know the real truth and facts, not just the allegations. Maybe this only happens in the movies… like Wall Street or Mr. Smith Goes To Washington.

          • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

            I never had any problem with the auction itself, or the selling of bids, or even paying commission on the bids.

            it’s the VIP points, that encourages participants to buy bids that serves no purpose other than pumping more money into “profit pool”, that determines their own profit share, that made Zeek a Ponzi.

            Compare Zeek’s plan with the “current” Bidify plan. They are night and day. This proves that it *is* possible to run a penny auction AND compensate affiliates without doing a Ponzi.

            In fact, if you strip out the RPP from the Zeek plan, you’d be left with something similar to Bidify’s current plan. Then the problem is why are affiliates getting paid commission for bids that are NOT USED, but “given back to the company”.

          • Chris Bailey

            Well, Troy, if you insist on thiinking that Paul Burks accidentally launched an illegal investment scheme by promising 125% returns over 90 days, I simply don’t hold out much hope for you. Such is life, lol.

            Hell, in that “secret” video from late last year, he acknowledged that there was no way to sustain that ROI for posting one per day to a classified ad site.

            He knew that what he was doing was unsustainable, yet he kept on doing it.

            How in the world does that lead you to believe this was all some happy accident?

            He kept running it the same way because he knew that if he actually eliminated the RPP or paid out a true reflection of the revenue/profits via the RPP, Zeek growth would have stalled almost instantly.

            All ponzis do this.

            At best, Burks would have been running yet another run-of-the-mill MLM program just like the ones he did prior to Zeek.

            I definitely agree about traditional MLM top guns getting involved and impacting growth. That’s why I asked Tissa a question elsewhere on this thread.

            Points = money to many/most of the affiliates.

            Just like the guy that was mentioned in The Dispatch saying that he had never made so much money in his life, yet he had not withdrawn a dime!

            That is a similar example to the emails you’ve received telling you that plenty of true believers in early enough to profit actually did not.

            The top affiliates setting their accounts to start cashing out illustrates that at least some may have been well-versed in the ebb and flow of ponzi games.

            They enjoy the ride as long as they can and then start pulling everything out when they feel the end is near.

            It’s not 1919 anymore. Ponzis have evolved with the times.

            Numbers on a screen is what all of these ponzis are.

            Paul Burks’ “dream” of everyone being successful was the perfect theme to keep people staring at numbers on a screen and not pulling out funds.

            After all, if you don’t let your points(money) grow, you won’t be able to enjoy a full time income from home buying a few bids every month and posting one ad per day.

            As I said before, these claims of wanting to create a system where Joe Blow can be a success are nothing new.

            Read the following for the YMMSS Development Story from Kim Inman, another man who “accidentally” created a ponzi.

            http://get-info-mt.tripod.com/ym-aubrey/Development-Story.html

            It ran almost flawlessly for almost 3 years before crumbling under it’s own weight.

            The man actually cried during the conference call when he announced they were shutting down.

            In 2004, I wrote an article of warning and posted it on one of my sites. My article and another site’s article generated enough interest to get Kim Inman to post his response/rebuttal.

            During it’s death throws in 2006, one of the moderators at the now defunct MatrixWatch forums reposted Kim Inman’s response and his thoughts on Kim’s response.

            If you read the post and Kim Inman’s response, you’ll see many of the same old claims about generating outside revenue, experts looking at and approving of the business model, etc.

            http://www.matrixwatch.com/forums/showpost.php?p=42589&postcount=2

            Even though YMMSS was a doubler that claimed to double your money on “advertising” purchases within 90 days, the basic premise is no different than Zeeks implied ROI of 125% over 90 days.

            Both were unrealistic, unsustainable, and illegal.

            As for lawyers and compliance teams, that has become all the rage now in the ponzi world. They are all starting to post how they’ve hired great lawyers and are legally compliant.

            Paul Burks didn’t need compliance teams to know what was wrong with the RPP. As stated in the “secret” video, he already knew. Again, he couldn’t unring that 125% ROI bell or his company would fail.

            Having a compliance team come in to change some wording on marketing materials and start terminating reps for promoting Zeek as exactly what it was didn’t change anything.

            And why would he need to change it. Paul Burks claimed this was all part of 10 years of working on his magical Exact Method Marketing system.. You know, that system that will make 95%+ success at marketing with no skills or abilities whatsoever.

            Burks was fully fluent in BS, just as every successful ponzi owner before him.

            I don’t know how many weeks worth of numbers you saw, and I’m not quite sure how to work with the example totals you posted.

            How do you pay out $150M if you only bring in $100M?

            Kinda sums things up nicely. :)

          • Troy Dooly

            @Chris,

            Thank you, again for taking time to shed some light on things. This really does help me as I document important facts. So far I have found only one really good book written on this subject, and each of those of you who truly do fight these ponzi schemes daily have helped me in my education.

      • Carpe

        @Troy
        “Paul Burks was following a dream of allowing the average person to earn money”? A dream that would have to take the hard earn money of the average persons Joe and Mary to give to the average person Dave, thereby, leaving Joe and Mary desvasted, while the average person Dave earning money on the expense of Joe and Marry…. Wow, what a dream!

        And Troy, please don’t tell me that the business model would be fine has the SEC didn’t jump in to shut it down before it has a chance to correct itself, and that the average persons Joe and Marry would be earning exactly the same way as Dave even afer the modification.

        There are many ways to “follow a dream of allowing the average person to earn money,” Mr. Burks didn’t have to use the Ponzi scheme to hurt the majority average persons and help just only a small number of “the average person”.

        Mr. Burks knew from day one that he was running a ponzi scheme – based on what he said on the video which you posted on your site before. – an average person who has a knowledge of what is a Ponzi scheme would know that a Ponzi schem would fail in two ways:
        1) when the money coming in can no longer support the promised payment.
        2) when the governemt shut down before it reaches to the point of collapse, that is when situation #1 happens.

        The average person should know that either way, the majority of the average persons will be hurt deeply. And you tell me that this is how Paul Burks was following his dream of allowing the average person to earn money – help a few while hurting the majority? Is he normal? And you truly believe in his way of following the dream? Please don’t tell me Mr. Burks didn’t know there was a problem with the RPP, until you told him so.

        • Troy Dooly

          @Carpe,

          I fully agree. I invested many hours talking with Paul, and listening to him speak, he shared in detail his dream and goal. I have read through his past documents and writings on this issue and his passion in creating a system that would work for the average person is not in question at all.

          Now, you do bring up a great point on the system he dreamed of creating… would or could it work. I just invested many hours with a client, as they worked to create a unique and first of the kind compensation plan. On paper it sure looked like it would work… BUT!

          Once it was written into the software and the math algorithms were run under real-time situations, it failed. It failed for the company and most of all for the distributors who would have joined this company. Instead of blowing off the “what if, worst case scenarios” they realized this was NOT the right move, and wrote off the $20K plus it took to create the plan, and code it, and went to a plan that was tried and proven.

          Maybe this is something Paul Burks never did, and when the SEC ran the numbers under a real-life, worse case scenario they found the compensation plan just did not work.

          Hmmm… I have never said the “business model would be find it the SEC had not stepped in.” I have stated that many changes were to by implemented due to the issues 9some that the SEC did bring up), and that we will NEVER know if those changes could have fixed the issue.

          I will disagree with you on your scenario. If the cashback/shopping mall would have been launched, then each affiliates would have been paid off of real customer dollars to the tune of 2,4,6,8,10 customers to 1 affiliate. As affiliates would have qualified for bonuses those bonuses would have been from real customer dollars, not from what the SEC has deemed an “unregistered security”. And in not counting in the rest of the changes, you can not come to a finate conclusion that folks would have continued to be paid as they had been.

          Now, where I will agree with you is, that if Paul Burks felt that by adding qualifiers, it would have proven his dream did not work, and he was shown that his dream had really created a ponzi scheme, then maybe he decided out of guilt that he had done the very thing he had never dreamed of doing… harming the average person. Based on the evidence maybe he consented to surrounding his company and paying a fine. But only he and the SEC really know for sure.

          I would disagree, I personal do NOT believe the average person or even the average attorney can see a ponzi. If this was a true and logical deduction, then we would not have attorneys who specialize in financial laws. Or who write books for several hundreds of dollars to help attorneys understand what a ponzi truly is. And it would not be so hard for affiliates to find attorneys willing to represent them in this case specifically.

          I think you must not have read much of what has been written here for months, or you would know that the conversation has been centered around what HAS been wrong with the RPP, and HOW it needed to be changed or eliminated. If you think I was the first, then think again. As a matter of fact, it seems you do NOT realize the current compensation plan was a huge CHANGE from what the original compensation plan was. Paul Burks plan had already been changed by Gerry Nehra and Keith Laggos. Exactly how long have you been following Zeek Rewards?

          • Carpe

            @Troy

            Hmmm… I have never said you said that the “business model would be find it the SEC had not stepped in” and put a period right there. Please do not quote me by cutting off my sentence in half. Please read the full sentence again or at least give me the benefit of a doubt just what you have been so generous to Paul Burks. By the way… In no way did I give you a credit of being the first person who pointed out the problem with RPP, please read my comment carefully.

            So, basically you give Paul Burks the benefits of the doubt that Paul Burks did not realize he was running a Ponzi scheme? And because he did not know it, so Zeek is a legitimate business?

            From what you have responded to Chris above regarding the Zeek business model, I have no further discussion with you about Zeek business model!

            Now to answer your question to me….. I joined Zeek long enough and put in Zeek large enough money to experince the Zeek business model and to feel the pain which resulted from Mr. Burks’ kindhearted dream of helping others. Long enough to see how the compensation plan changed, long enough to witness those final weeks of Zeek. Enough to see how affiliates were panic or extremely worried – whichever way you want to put it – in the private Zeek support forum after hearing the rumor news about the up coming new qualifiers cashback/shopping program which you mentioned in your reply because they argued that the new modified comp plan was not what they signed into the first place. Enough to see how affiliates started to question Zeek business model, and smell something fishy with it in the Zeek support forum during the last final days of zeek. Enough to see how the upline affiliates started to panic, and suggested a full withdrawal upon the news of the request to investigation fron NCDOJ. Enough to agree with SEC in its decision to call it as an Emergency Shut Down.

            That’s all that I know, Troy. I know you know a lot more than me because during the final breath of Zeek, your contact info was appeared in the private Zeek support forum as a person who affiliates could turn to to get all their problem solved and give them all the answers since the Zeek corporate just turned silent on them during the last few weeks of Zeek….. And this is why I am here to learn more about Zeek from you.

          • Troy Dooly

            @Carpe,

            Sometimes the tough part about responding to a comment is you can’t hear the tone in which a person is writing at times. My intent is not to offend you at all.

            I do not think there is doubt in anyone’s mind that I gave Paul Burks the benefit of the doubt. But the reason I gave him the benefit of the doubt, is because I have long term business and personal relationships with the legal, compliance and compensation team experts hired to make sure the company was running a legal network marketing business opportunity. I did not give him any benefit of the doubt until January of 2012.

            And no, Zeek was seen as a legal network marketing income opportunity (legit business) again because of the conversations I have with the team hired to make sure it was legit. The same team that was not allowed to defend their positions in what they created, nor were they contacted by the SEC to ask any specific questions about why they had made specific changes from the original compensation and business structure that Paul Burks had created.

            Interesting… If you read through all the comments here then you know the support forum was what you described for over nine months. It was not in the last days. I think Oz, covered the support forum better than anyone, it was a long term issue. And, you are right many of those who did not want the qualifiers pushed hard to keep the company from implementing them for months. Had those qualifiers gone in way before Dawn took off for Rome, then this might be a mute subject right now.

            Without a doubt some folks would have left Zeek if all they were looking for was a money game. But the network marketing income model might still be rolling along today.

            Affiliates turned to MLMHelpDesk, not because all of a sudden Zeek corporate stopped communicating. You should know this was also a long term issue that was covered here and across the net. Folks turned to this community and others because all of us wanted to provide real answers, not silence.

            Well there is much we all still want to learn about Zeek. And hopefully before it is all over we will.

          • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

            This was not meant as a personal insult, Troy, but those of us watching from the outside, it seems, at least to us, that you gave a bit too much “benefit of the doubt” to all the experts you’ve known for years and “trusted” implicitly.

            I have no idea what relationship does Kevin Grimes have with Burks, and I am pretty sure it’s covered under attorney-client privilege that Mr. Grimes can’t tell you even if he wanted to. I suspect that Burks / RVG only bought that “compliance course” (mlmcompliancevt.com) from him and didn’t really put him on retainer, but then, I don’t know if it’s it’s enough for A-C relationship to be established.

            You knew Gerald Nehra for a very long time, but he already goofed once on ASD, as many others had pointed that out months ago. He won’t be able to tell us just what did he advise Burks to do, and how much of that was actually done.

            Laggos… Enough to say that he’s been double-dipping all this time (consulting, AND be an affiliate at the same time?!), and apparently even you didn’t know about that. That’s just wrong on so many levels…

            I understand your philosophy that you are more than willing to give people benefit of the doubt esp. if you know them well enough, but this seems to be one of the cases it was used against you.

            One may even suspect that Burks knew he can convince you if he hired all the people you personally knew as consultants, and once you are convinced, it’s easy to convince many more affiliates.

            You started off warning people that Zeek was high-risk. WHO convinced you to take another look, prompting you to change your mind two months later?

          • Troy Dooly

            @K, Chang,

            No insult taken :)

            BTW, Grimes was on retainer for the specific purpose of being available if needed for any regulatory issues. This was above and beyond the complaince side of things.

            And I will agree this could be a time where knowing the legal, compliance and comp plan team could have truly worked against me. But, I would truly like to know for sure exactly, why this team was ot allowed to defend their positions.

            I will not disagree with you that “SOMEONE” knew they could convince me if they hired all the people you personally knew as consultants, and once I was convinced, it’s easy to convince many more affiliates. You may have a point on that one, and I have already started doing some digging into that issue. :)

            As always thank you for taking time to comment and add value to this community.

  • http://vip047332271@twitter Henry Alvarez

    Troy Keep up the good job and information coming to us, I have 35 affiliates under me, hope we could get our money back, or maybe Zeek may open their door again I feel that Mr Bells he got the money in his possession, Maybe just to created attorneys fees, is North Carolina he may be relative to the Judge, thats why he is the receiver. Sorry dont trust the system.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Henry,

      First of all thank you for your kind words.

      I can understand NOT trusting the system. However, in most cases, maybe not all, I have found that men who are given great responsibility seem to live up to that responsibility. I have read much on Mr. Bell outside of this specific situation and it brings much for all to think about. I do not think it was be chance that Mr. Bell was brought in to this case as the Receiver. Read below from a press release put out when he was made partner.

      “Ken is a superb litigator and has developed a strong network of white collar criminal defense lawyers,” added Tom Cottingham, managing partner of
      the Charlotte office. “His experience in high-stakes investigations-such as his role in the 2002 conviction of a Hezbollah cell in Charlotte-provides
      him an in-depth understanding of the challenges facing our clients.”

      Kenneth D. Bell focuses his practice on white collar criminal matters, internal and government investigations, including commercial and financial investigations and anti-money laundering, RICO and cases before the Fourth Circuit Court of Appeals. Before joining private practice, he served 17 years as a prosecutor in the U.S. Attorney’s Office in Charlotte, the last 10 as First Assistant United States Attorney overseeing prosecution of all federal criminal offenses and civil enforcement in 32 western counties. He has received awards and citations from the Department of Justice, FBI, DEA, U.S. Secret Service, U.S. Customs Service, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and the IRS. Bell received his undergraduate and law degrees from Wake Forest University.

      Bell gained national recognition for the 2002 conviction of a Hezbollah terrorist cell in Charlotte, uniquely obtaining convictions for providing support to a terrorist organization, RICO, money laundering and conspiracy. The ring, which sold $7.5 million in contraband cigarettes, also arranged for the delivery of military equipment, such as mine detection gear, blasting equipment and night-vision goggles, to Hezbollah. One of the defendants was sentenced in 2003 to 155 years in prison. Bell successfully introduced wire tap records from the Canadian Security Intelligence Service, the first and only time such records have been used in a U.S. court. For his groundbreaking work, he was honored with the prestigious U.S. Attorney General John Marshall Award for Trial of Litigation and with a special commendation from the Director of the Canadian Security Intelligence Service (CSIS).”

      Now add that to the following…

      “The white collar and special investigations practice at Hunton & Williams covers a broad spectrum of white collar cases, including environmental criminal and regulatory enforcement actions; health care fraud; internal and government investigations; public and private corruption, bribery, and kickback schemes; tax violations; money laundering; computer-related criminality; financial, banking, and securities laws violations; U.S. Customs investigations into dumping,
      undervaluation, high technology transfer, and smuggling; Foreign Corrupt Practice Act violations; international and domestic fraud schemes of every
      type; RICO proceedings; and espionage and terrorism cases.”

      We get a far better picture at why Mr. Kenneth D. Bell may have been appointed as the Receiver over Rex Venture Group, LLC.. And if you review all I have spoke and written over the last nine or ten months you will see where many times I talked about possible cyber-terrorist rings, RICO charges, and international ponzi organizations working inside Zeek Rewards.

      So, although we do not know for sure why Paul Burks decided to turn over the assets. It could very well be this whole situation is far bigger than what we see on the surface.

      • logic

        “Well there is much we all still want to learn about Zeek. And hopefully before it is all over we will.”

        Mr. troy, Up to this stage of the process, you still defend ZR and the people behind it. I believe that you are not a naive person and that you are a very intelligent individual. But right now, you are making yourself sound like an idiot that was brainwashed like all ZR affiliates. Again, I would hope that you still have enough integrity to right the ship and start the healing process for all involved.

        “WHAT MORE CAN YOU LEARN ABOUT ZEEK?”

        • Troy Dooly

          @Logic,

          As always thanks for commenting. I do not think I have ever defended Zeek Rewards. I will admit that I have defended the people behind Rex Venture Group, and what they seemed to be doing to make Zeek Rewards work and to get it fully complaint.

          Not, sure how you come to the conclusion, I am making myself out to be an idiot. Now it might help if you were to give a specific statement I made that caused you to draw this conclusion.

          I will gladly admit, I strongly defend the Constitution of the United States, and in doing so, would like to see 100% of the evidence in this case, and have it weighted out through a public trial. And if that is what you are using to come to your conclusion, then I am guilty as charged.

          Outside of that, I am as opened minded as anyone. If I wasn’t, then like some other sites, I would only be promoting “Zeek Will Rise Again!” I do not believe that in the slightest, nor do I believe beyond a shadow of a doubt, that my opinions of some of the crew who ran Rex Venture Group, is infallible and they could not have blown smoke up my butt.

          As for the healing process… I believe of all places, this is a good place for healing. Folks know that no matter what side they are on, they are accepted, and we will allow them to vent and get their emotions out. We will also continue to allow people far wiser than I am in these matters to help guide them to the right decisions.

          As for “what more can I learn about Zeek?” that may not be the right question. It may be better to say “What more do I know about Zeek that has not been made public?”

  • Jeff

    Troy, I for one am grateful that you keep us updated. At first after all this happened. I was pretty angry towards you and anyone else that spoke highly of ZR. Thanks for taking the side of giving as much information to the affiliates.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Jeff,

      Sir I fully understand. Thank you for continuing to hold with me and understand where my heart is focused.

  • Bilal00740

    so when zeek back in action are all the accounts starts where from closed

    • Troy Dooly

      @Bila100740,

      I think there is some huge confusion going on outside of this community. Paul Burks the single owner of Rex Venture Group, LLC, the parent company of Zeek Rewards, decided, as is his right, to surrender Zeek Rewards to the SEC plus pay them $4 million dollars after they presented him with the allegations and evidence they had gathered (with his support) so they would not go after him or his family in court for running a ponzi.

      No matter what happens in the future, Zeek Rewards as folks knew it is gone. If any group of former Zeek Affiliates sue the SEC, they are suing to stop clawbacks. If they can stop the clawbacks, get a judge or jury to review the evidence and rule that the business model was a legit business model with flaws, then they could stop their clawbacks… maybe!

      But, the judge will not surrender back to them or sell them the former assets of Zeek Rewards. The Receiver is now in full control of those old assets. A new company would have to be formed, funded and launched.

      • Anonymous PEter

        Dear Troy!

        Paul Burks didn’t surrender Zeekrewards, Paul Burks JUDGMENT is FINAL and he is GUILTY!!!

        If you read the court documents you would know that Paul Burks and their employees are guilty too. They cannot do anything at all. Paul Burks is guilty based on those documents. It is signed by the judge and its clean in the documents that he have been violated SEC laws. thanks :-)

        • Troy Dooly

          @Anonymous PEter,

          Not sure what court documents you have NOT read, or if you fully understand them.

          1. The SEC presented the allegations to Paul Burks and his attorneys. The Complaint

          2. After Paul and his attorney were presented with the complaint and whatever evidence the SEC had against him, they drafted a Consent presented it to the SEC they accepted and Paul Burks signed off. )The Consent RVG The Consent Paul Burks

          3. Then comes the Judgement as drafted by the SEC and the Judge ruled on… The Judgement RVG The Judgement Paul Burks

          4. And at the same time came the request for the temporary receiver and freeze of the assets. The Order

          Now since then many more documents have been filed. But to say Paul Burks did not voluntarily surrender his assets, is not correct. The fact the judgement is final has never been up for debate. When a US citizen decides to voluntarily surrender his assets to any regulatory agency, instead of fighting in a court of law, is his Right.

          It doesn’t change the fact I would like to see what the SEC wanted sealed, and any other evidence that has not been cross-examined by corporate counsel and defended by the SEC.

          I have read the court documents, and have not seen any mention yet of other employees of Rex Venture Group being named specifically. Maybe I have not gotten to that document yet. If you can direct me to the specific document that would be great. Or maybe I missed it in what I have read.

          Thank you for sharing.

        • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

          Technically Burks entered a “no contest” plea, which has the same “immediate effect” as guilty plea. It is common in white collar crimes.

  • http://TissaGodavitarne.com Tissa Godavitarne

    I know this won’t make me popular amongst all those who are publicly and privately worried about clawbacks, but this isn’t about them:

    I’m one of those “who took more out of Rex Ventures than they put in”.

    For me, the turning point was when Paul Burks chose not to contest the SEC complaint. That left no doubt in my mind that there was merit to the complaint. I suspect that will be corroborated by criminal charges in the future.

    I don’t buy the “settling is not an admission of guilt” or “protecting his family from a trial” arguments. What about fighting to protect his family’s good name if he knew he wasn’t running a criminal enterprise? Whereas I didn’t previously, I now believe that Zeek was indeed a Ponzi.

    That means there are people who “received little or nothing from this enterprise” after sending in thousands of dollars (life-savings in some cases). That’s an indisputable fact. Knowing that, there’s no way, in good conscience, I could fight any clawback attempts.

    I sure as heck won’t contribute to any “legal defense funds” which only benefit the “Chosen 12″, and I won’t participate in any class actions by lawyers (including Kevin Thompson, whom I do respect) since ultimately their fees WILL reduce what’s available for those who truly lost money.

    Instead, I’ll do my best to comply with any legally valid directives I receive from Kenneth Bell, including “surrendering my gains” with the hopes of “making everyone as whole as possible”. I’m not a fan of the government running rampant over citizens, but in this case, there’s no other path I personally could live with.

    I would hope there are others in my position who feel the same way.

    After all, it’s not as if I busted my butt for those gains. All I did was copy and paste an ad every day, and in my mind that doesn’t justify robbing Peter to pay Paul.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Tissa,

      Hmmm… You know, you do make a very valid point on “protecting your family name!” I had not given that much thought, but I know that in the South a person’s family name is an important asset. When one causes shame to come upon the family name it can cause some major issues. People have feuded and fought for years to protect or return the honor of their family name.

      Thanks Tissa… Again some good food for thought.

    • Chris Bailey

      “After all, it’s not as if I busted my butt for those gains. All I did was copy and paste an ad every day, and in my mind that doesn’t justify robbing Peter to pay Paul”

      You know, it’s statements like this from people that I believe should have known better that concerns me almost as much as the existence of sites like MMG and TalkGold.

      Guys like Tissa, Troy, and others that have been around the MLM block a time or two and know what it takes to actually build an organization and turn a profit.

      Tissa, in particular, runs at least one of his own companies.

      Why in the world would you not be able to see that a monthly spend + posting one classified ad per day could not possibly warrant the ROI that was being paid on bids?

      Just a few top MLM guys like you have influence over tens of thousands of people looking to find legitimate money making avenues on line.

      Hopefully, you didn’t push Zeek too hard to your lists.

      I’m seriously stumped as tohow people who have been around the internet marketing world and know how traffic and revenue is actually generated could possibly join Zeek without thinking things were a bit suspect.

      • Troy Dooly

        @Chris,

        Very valid points sir. And in a comment here in this thread, you can see where a former Zeek Affiliate, mentions that folks inside the Zeek Support Forum was not happy with me for suggesting for months that more than copy and paste needed to be expected. Pushing for customer qualifiers and pushing for real customer dollars is something I have talked about since April.

        But your point is very valid.

      • http://TissaGodavitarne.com Tissa Godavitarne

        Points well-taken, Chris.

        To answer your question: “Why in the world would you not be able to see that a monthly spend + posting one classified ad per day could not possibly warrant the ROI that was being paid on bids?”

        My firm belief at the time was that the retail business (the penny auction) was generating far greater revenues (due to all the advertising by affiliates) than the SEC complaint subsequently revealed.

        You wrote, “Hopefully, you didn’t push Zeek too hard to your lists.”

        My team was a small, closely-knit group of individuals, each of whom was made aware of the risks upfront. (This message serves as a good example of how I promoted Zeek to everyone: http://on.fb.me/OvBDrr)

        I didn’t pull wool over anyone’s eyes, so it’s not my team that I’m concerned about. It’s those I’ve never met, who may have subsidized my profits – they are the reason I’m willing to surrender my gains.

        • Chris Bailey

          Thank you for the reply and the link Tissa.

          On that FB snapshot, you state “I always promoted Zeek as a high-risk opportunity, and everyone on my team knew the risks.”

          Can you define what you meant by “high-risk”?

          I know one of Troy’s new best friends, Todd Hirsch, defined high risk as thinking Zeek might be a ponzi and still felt it was okay to promote it stating just what you did, that he informed his recruits of that.

          Of course, in his case, that mentality completely disregards the victims that contribute to his profits.

          Oh well, I guess I’ll never understand how anyone experienced would think that tremendous revenue would be generated posting ads to free classifieds, no matter how many affiliates were doing it.

          But, I guess different perspectives keep life interesting.

    • logic

      Tissa,
      Good for you. I hope you will have peace within yourself.

  • Sally

    I don’t understand this. Why not just take the money that has been obtained, look to see who purchased bids and had not cashed out, look to see who sent in cashiers checks but were not deposited, and look to see who funded their ewallets but had not spent it or received any money from Zeeks, and just give them their money back? All this requires is a few savvy programmers to write a few scripts to do the calculations. Deal with the clawbacks issue separately because it will be like trying to find a needle in a haystack and will tie up the entire process. And you’d better believe this receiver is going to try to use some of this “found” money to pay himself and his staff for the countless hours that they are supposedly using to figure this out. And that’s simply not fair because it’s not their money to have. This is just absurd! I just want my freakin’ money back.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Sally,

      Great question. The main reason is the Receiver is still working on uncovering all the assets. Once all th assets have been recovered, then each affiliate account (2 million) will have to be reviewed to see who is truly owned a refund, and who might have to pay back some of their earnings.

      I believe during that part of the process, a template will be created for the affiliate to fill out providing their information.

      I would suspect that some affiliates who’s accounts have been frozen but who had never bought a bid, will see their funds release sooner than others. But there is no way to make the clawback issue separate, because those affiliates also deserve a right to decide if they want to give back any money their earned, protect and or fight to protect their earnings.

      Just like Paul Burks each affiliate will have the right to protect or surrender their assets to the Government.

    • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

      Would you rather have the taxpayers, who are NOT a part of the lawsuit (victim or perp or justice) foot the receiver’s bill instead?

      One of the latest attempts by the people out there to muddy the waters is spreading lies and innuendos about the receiver. You just repeated one of them: that the receiver will eat up the fees in “shuffling paper”. Another lie being spread was that the receiver will never give any money back.

      Judging by past cases, both allegations are completely baseless.

      Bankruptcy trustee Irving Picard, who handled the Bernie Madoff Ponzi, clawed back 9 BILLION (yes, that’s with a B) dollars from various sources, and it will be disbursed later this year, pending approval from a judge. He was delayed by several lawsuits and resolution of his clawback lawsuits.

      Rust Consulting paid back 100% of the losses of the victims who registered for restitution in the Ad Surf Daily cases over three rounds of restitution. Todd Disner, who filed lawsuit against the Feds as an ASD affiliate, claimed that he was NOT AWARE of restitution program handled by Rust Consulting. Disner is also a top member of ZeekRewards, and is believed to be helping Craddock and Kettner.

      While there is no guarantee that Ken Bell, the receiver will do his job as well as these two famous cases, there’s also no sign that he will NOT do his job. Thus, your unfounded “negativity” is uncalled for.

  • Saint charlus noel

    I want zeek reopen, I had money in this busness

    • http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.com K. Chang

      You get refund later. Zeek no real business. Cannot reopen.

  • lee kim

    sorry saint charlus noel, i want zeek to reopen also but it is not going to happen. now i just want money back for the ppl that join me. im so sorry for you and me and everyone that lost our money in zeek. we all had hope that this will change our lives. i would not be this hurt if i didnt ask ppl to join me. money i can make it back some how but i cannt have all the trust back from friends and families. i hope you will get your money back.

  • tom

    The Chosen Twelve….wonder if they are all named Judas?

    • logic

      Zeekers should focus on how to find a way to freeze the bank accounts of the chosen 12. They withdrew a good portions of the funds from the affiliates. The funds that they donate for them should’ve have been used to file suit against them, not the SEC. But zeekers should have faith in the Receiver and let them do there job. This process will take time and you will have an opportunity to file your claim. They are your attorney and they are working for you to maximize the return of your money. No need to join a class action suit or hire your own attorney, because they can not influence the outcome of the amount. Look at the history of past cases and be patient. I myself did not join ZR, because I did my due diligence, but my family lost over 200k. After ZR, they now understand what a Ponzi scheme is.

  • Lin

    When will the money from NxPay be released? I was just getting started with Zeek, had just transferred money to NxPay and then the bottom fell out. Doesn’t seem fair that my money is being held hostage since I never invested in Zeek at that point.

  • Carpe

    @Troy,

    The support forum was closed to the public due to many “critics” covering of the forum! This was another red-flag for me when this was happened while I was on my way to figure out what exactly Zeek was.

    Many affiliates had come to you long before the final weeks of Zeek, but not at a peak during the final weeks, and not as obvious as “Zeek don’t answer you, Troy will.”

    In fact, I got to your help desk through a link of Zeek affiliate promoter. Of course, I was not with Zeek from the beginning. It was you that we trusted in the beginning without doing much of our due diligent, but only trusted your words that Zeek is legitimate and put in $40,000.00 into Zeek altogether.

    After I accidentally discovered that I was misled by my sponsor, instead of starting to withdraw the money like a way as my gut was telling me, but like you, I gave Zeek a benefit of a doubt, and argued that since they changed their comp plan to be complianced with the laws, so it couldn’t be “bad”, and Troy also said that it’s legitimate too.

    But… I trust, then go verify my hypothesis that Zeek is NOT legitimate. The more I dig, including spending hours and hours listenning and joining current and archived leadership conferences and training, support forum, newsletters, facebook, talking to people who were in Zeek long before me, and outside forums which I then encountered critics’ forums, and this is where I first learned about the word Ponzi scheme. Then I wasted my time on educating myself about what is a Ponzi scheme.

    The more I researched, the more I could not in no way defend Zeek, disprove my hypothesis, and defend my decision of putting in 10K into Zeek. The more research I did, the more I was freaked out to learn that there is a very high chance that I’m in the middle of a Ponzi scheme.

    Finally, Troy, when I could no longer defend Zeek due to so many red flags coming directly from Zeek, and seeing how its model is exactly the same as ASD, a convicted Ponzi case, I decided to warn my family members and pushed them to withdraw all the money. Unfortunately, it was too late, and we lost everything. The only thing I was able to do was to stop all my family memers’ and my downline to put in any money. So, ALL our downlines were saved from this mess – thanks goodness they were patient enough to wait for my research and were having difficulty of setting up e-wallet, and use Visa for their subscription payment. — a note: The 1.8 million affiliates doesn’t mean all have put money in. Some are fake accounts due to Zeek computer problem, many affiliates created more than just one account for their downline. My brother has 5 fake accounts under him due to multiple registrations in the first place as he thought it didn’t go through the first time.

    That is how I learned about Zeek business model. An expensive lesson. Believe me or not, Troy, if I have a choice, I wouldn’t spend my time checking your sites and the critics site for more information. I’m not a fan of a virtual social network. I’m hoping Zeek case closed soon, so I can move on with.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Carpe,

      Thanks once again for sharing your thoughts.

  • Jim

    300 million dollars is a lot of money that the SEC has frozen, that gives me hope I will get a good portion of my 10k back I put in June, I never took out a dime or got anyone else involved, that was my life savings (yea i know stupid) lesson learned, but I take very serious what the receiver emails me, and I pay close attention to what kschang says, I should have paid more attention to kschang from the beginning. But this is a life long lesson for me and I’m sure many others, I just pray myself and other victims of this travesty get some of our money back.

    • Morten

      @Jim

      In the ASD case (AutoSurfDaily, Andy Bowdoin), around 10% of the victims filed claims, and they received 100% of their investment back. But you can’t expect to be that lucky in this case.

      I’m not very familiar with the ASD case, but it had an estimated 97,000 members. 8,400 victims were identified, according to one of the articles I have read on PatrickPretty.com. The paybacks to victims isn’t quite finished yet, they do still have some funds.

      In the Zeek case, some people with relatively low investments will probably not bother to file any claims. They will prefer to finish the case ASAP instead of waiting 2-3 years for a dividend (or maybe even longer).

      Most of the time, I recommended people to lower the risk by withdrawing some of their principal investment, e.g. withdraw 20% or (preferrably) more. A strategy like that will make a huge difference for what people feel about something if the scheme collapses.

      A typical plan was
      * “2 weeks at 100% reinvestment, followed by 2 weeks of 100% withdrawal, until you feel more comfortable with the risk. It will also reduce your reward, so use a spreadsheet to find a plan yourself”.

      A strategy like that isn’t solely about money, it’s more about making calculated decisions rather than being “all in” all the time (ignoring the risk involved).

      When filing a claim to the Receivership, I would probably have included membership fees and other expenses paid directly to Rex Venture Group. I would probably also have included retail bids bought through family members,– the method some affiliates used to earn 20% extra commission (20% extra, compared to buying sample bids).

  • Jonny

    Troy, can you explain how zeek was going to change on August the 22nd. Just so others can hear what else was being done inside zeek. Thank you in advance.

    • Troy Dooly

      @Jonny,

      Many of the changes have been discussed for months. But here are a few…

      1. New qualifiers where depending on the individual point value, each affiliate would need 2,4,6,8,10 active (spending $7 to $10 per transaction) customers who were not inside the compensation structure, through the ZeeBates.com cashback/shopping mall. All this money was to be placed inside the RPP.

      This one change could have caused many to become disqualified for the RPP until they acquired these customers, and that could have slowed the growth of the company to a crawl until folks were re-qualified. By the way, affiliates were warned of this pending change for months.

      2. There were talks of caps being put into place to limit the max payout of the RPP.

      3. And in the final days, there was also talk of eliminating the RPP all together.

      There were other changes talked about that I was not aware of, and there was also the mention of a pending purchase of an MLM company that would have provided hundreds of thousands of customers to my understanding.

      • PPBlog

        Troy wrote: “2. There were talks of caps being put into place to limit the max payout of the RPP.”

        I replied: ASD used a form of the “Caps” feint, too. It was right out of the scammer’s playbook and is part of the reason Andy Bowdoin is in jail.

        This is from Paragraph 18 of an affidavit originally filed under seal by the U.S. Secret Service in February 2009, about six months after the ASD probe began:

        ” . . . Bowdoin limited investments or ad package purchases to $12,000 because he did not want
        members to loose too much money should ASD collapse.”

        https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=sites&srcid=ZGVmYXVsdGRvbWFpbnxhc2R1cGRhdGVzZmlsZXN8Z3g6NzFjNzI0YjE4NzVjYWQ3Ng

        Yes, Bowdoin was worried about a collapse EVEN DURING ASD’s days of attracting millions of dollars a week because he knew he was at the helm of a Ponzi scheme and that Ponzi schemes inevitably collapse.

        In HYIP Ponzi land, it is not unusual for talk of “caps” to begin when the operator begins to realize the Ponzi is teetering and that he risks a tumble into the hungry lion’s den

        The backstory is this: ASD started out with no cap. In May 2008, Bowdoin told the “rally” troops in Las Vegas that he was implementing a cap of $50,000 to keep the SEC happy and to “make sure that people are getting into it for the right reason . . .”

        See Bowdoin indictment, particularly Paragraph 23:

        http://www.justice.gov/usao/dc/programs/vw/pdf/adsurfdaily_docs/adsurfdaily_Bowdoin_Indictment_FILED_Nov_23_2010.pdf

        This is the type of thing that Oz at BehindHML.com has described in his Zeek coverage as “pseudo compliance.” In the Legisi HYIP Ponzi case, the Feds used a different phrase: “semantic obfuscation.”

        ASD was awash it it, as was Zeek — all the crap about not using certain words, all the veiled or direct references to “compliance,” all the blaming of affiliates for using language banned by the “program,” all the talk about “caps.”

        It is hogwash — ALL of it.

        In any event, Bowdoin then allegedly lowered the cap from $50,000 to about $12,000. So, the trail looks approximately like this:

        No cap >> $50,000 cap >> $12,000 cap.

        Here is how the Secret Service described that trail:

        “[T]o ensure that no individual investor monopolized the rebate pool, and to reduce the likelihood that any individual investor would suffer a catastrophic loss, Bowdoin placed a limit on the amount of ‘advertising’ members could purchase. Of course, it would have made no sense to impose such limitations if ASD was actually selling, and members actually were purchasing, Internet advertising.”

        PPBlog

        • Troy Dooly

          @Patrick,

          Thank you for taking time from your own community to add value for all here.

  • Singh

    TD…as in touchdown game over..Thanks for this incredible effort. Your gracefulness is much appreciated by me and my family. I had been in ZEEK since Apiril 2012. ‘…dreamin the dream’. Could u give us an approximate timeline for 1,2,3 and the pending purchase of an existing MLM for customers?

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